Subtitles vs Closed Caption

[_Paz_]

My first post in this subforum! I've downloaded PrePro CS6. The box containing my license number should arrive within the next week or so. I'm both excited and a bit overwhelmed, what with AE being a recent addition as well. So much to learn! So little brain!

Subtitles vs Closed Captions:

I've learned when buying movies on DVD that I want subtitles, not closed captions. Captions do not show up on my TV screen when played on my DVD/BluRay player. Subtitles do. Aside from that I don't know the difference in them. I vaguely remember something about a 'line 21'. Not sure what that means.

I've spent a few hours trying to get "text from speech" from a short clip. I have the clip selected, I'm in the Metalogging Workspace, I've figured out that the button to push didn't show up because I needed to enlarge the work box by dragging it more fully open. I've downloaded the "American English" download. I've gone into properties for the file in question in Windows Explorer and un-clicked 'read only.'

But no matter what I do, I can't figure out how to get the Analyze text button to work or the Analyze in the drop down menu to not be greyed out.

(Maybe I downloaded the American English but didn't install it. I'll go double check that.)

[_Paz_]

Downloaded American English (again) and International English and installed them both. (Accents in southeastern USA are supposed to be more similar to various regional dialects of British English than northern USA.)

Analyze still greyed out. The video and audio are not next to one another on the timeline. I tried to select audio individually, even though I have not unlinked audio and video. Didn't work anyway.

Finally, Edit> Select All and the Analyze button lit up, so I clicked it. Adobe Media Encoder opened. I ran it. Eventually it was done. Now I have an "f4V" file in my Windows Explorer file folder for this group of video clips. I don't see a way to get that back into Premiere Pro to see how well the speech to text analyzer worked.

[_Paz_]

I tried importing the f4V file into PrePro. Selected, clicked Analyze and Adobe Encoder opened again. I ran the file. When it finished I closed the program since I couldn't figure out what else to do.

When I went back to PrePro, in the analyzed text box there was text. Gibberish, really.

(Are you supposed to have to open and run these things over and over?)

So I went through the entire sequence again with UK english and had a much higher percentage of hits of words I had actually used. There might have been 6 or 8 of them.

If it doesn't do any better than this...???

The sound footage I have probably isn't what I'm going to want to use in final product, but I talk as I go along so I will know in words what I mean to express as the painting sessions go along. Naturally, watching paint dry isn't thrilling and there will need to be many cuts and sped up places along the way. I thought when I put things together for a final product I would make a new recording and plug the recorder into my computer and let Dragon Natually Speaking make the translation. I've been using that product for a decade or more and as it learns as you go, it understands,mmm, probably 90% of what I say. Things improved by leaps and bounds when I found the Southeastern USA dialect buried deeply in one of their menus.

But from what I've read on the net, it appears Adobe only allows their own product, Adobe Story to bring speech/text into PrePro. Maybe Adobe Story can accept files from Final Draft, a popular screenwriting program. Naturally, I have Movie Magic, a different popular screenwriting program, instead. Dragon works with Movie Magic. It also works with Microsoft Word, which I have.

It seems the free version of Adobe Story is part of the creative cloud. When i got that far I couldn't bring myself to install it.

If I have to install a creative cloud component to get this to work, does that mean MY text will be stored on Adobe's servers? Would I have to be connected to the internet for it to work?

[Bob]

Select the clip to be analyzed after you open the metadata panel, you should be able to select just the one you want analyzed. After speech analysis is done, the text should display in the metadata panel -- there is nothing to load. You can close Media Encoder if you don't need it open. I don't use the feature, it's really designed for an environment where you are shooting dialog from a script and I'm not doing that. I've tried it and it's hit or miss, you really need clean, noise free audio and good enunciation. Once you have the text in the metadata, there's not much you can do with it. You can play back in the source monitor and the text will highlight as it plays. You can search for text and play. And, you can set in and out points and do an insert. But, that seems to be about it. You can right click on the text and do a copy all and paste that into a word processor. But, if you have Dragon, you can do that there and probably get better results.

I haven't tried using Story. There are two version. Story Free and Story CC Plus. As the name suggests, Story Free is no cost. Story CC Plus is not free, but, unless you are collaborating with other screenwriters, Story Free would be sufficient. To get it, you need to setup a Creative Cloud ID, but you don't have to subscribe to anything. In Story Free, you would create a script document, import your text, add scene numbers (it won't export if you don't), and save as a ".astx" document. In Premiere Pro, you would specify the saved ".astx" document as the embedded script.

[_Paz_]

Once you have the text in the metadata, there's not much you can do with it.

Perhaps I'm missing the point. Is there a different method to creating subtitles?

No other screenwriters involved and I don't really think I could follow a pre-written script because you don't know what you need to say before something comes up that needs to be mentioned while the paint is wet.

I want to have a text transcript of what I've said that can be made into subtitles after it is done. With PreEl 11 I had planned on manually inserting text. Downside is there would be a lot of work to do that and lots of people are put off by having subtitles they cannot turn off. On the other hand, I believe educational material should be as effective for every potential user, if possible. I've known plenty of people with hearing problems who have gravitated towards painting specifically because it is a non-verbal method of communication.

[_Paz_]

I came across this tutorial when looking for info on how to sync audio and video. The beginning shows how to trim to beats in a musical score. The second part shows how to set keyframes on specific words so the film can cut from the speaker to an illustrative shot relating to his topic.

It was the 2nd part of this that lead me to believe this would be the method to create subtitles based on what was actually said instead of having to manually write it all down and insert text.

Trimming to Beats and Words:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr9bWqXtuZ4[/youtube]

[Bob]

I think you misunderstood what he was demonstrating. He was using the speech analysis to locate specific words and place a marker. The markers added this way could be used to identify and navigate to specific points in the clip. It can be used to identify where to place the subtitle, but it doesn't use the text to actually create the subtitle. That you have to do yourself.

[_Paz_]

I understood what he was doing... I just jumped to the conclusion that it would be so fabulously easy to create subtitles that way, it must be possible!

I've found another tut that does show how to both import the right kind of file and how to create closed captions in Premiere Pro. At the end this guy shows how to export one way with the captions as a 'sidecar' file and another way with the captions embedded. Not sure if one way is going to be closed captions and the other will be subtitles or not.

I've learned that plugins can be used to create the subtitles. SugarFx is one. Some tut, maybe this one, mentioned Caption Maker for PC. There is a Mac version too.

I'll be watching this video tut over and over, I suspect!

Closed Captioning Workflow

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSsA89PRncw[/youtube]

[_Paz_]

The "Closed Captioning Workflow" video immediately above this post refers to Creative Cloud only. Options they show do not exist in PrePro CS6. (Or if they do I cannot find them.)

SugarFx, at $49, is Mac only. I did not investigate further.

http://www.sugarfx.tv/info/subtitles_SUGARfx.html

Pixel Tools' "Expert Caption" runs about $1500

http://www.wcliff.org/store/ss-index.html

CPC, mentioned in one of the videos above as the source for the .scc file runs about $5000 - to $7000, depending on who is talking. Educational versions may be less.

https://www.cpcweb.com/prices/


Movie Captioner, a bargain at $99, (Should be supplemented with QuickTime Pro, $30? $40?)

http://www.synchrimedia.com/buy_movcaptioner.html

can create .scc files, but PrePro CS6 cannot export them in the file. I've tried adding subtitles I manually typed using Movie Captioner trial into the Analyze Text box described in the putting markers to beats and putting markers to words video above, and initially the add box sees the correct text, but once Adobe Encoder runs it becomes gibberish again, so as far as I can figure, you still have to go in and manually correct everything in the Analyze box anyway.

At least when I try with the trial. Someone in the last link in this post says he can see the results of MovieCaptioner in his PrePro CS6 preview but it will not export with the file. I can't figure out how to even get it to show up.

Apparently some versions of Vegas Pro will create subtitles/closed captions. At least one person says so in this thread over at Adobe:

http://forums.adobe.com/message/4878736

[_Paz_]

Encore for subtitles!

Followed some breadcrumbs Bob left behind when he was helping someone else with subtitles a while back.

THANKS BOB!

(Now if I can figure out how to open Encore! )

http://help.adobe.com/en_US/encore/cs/using/WSbaf9cd7d26a2eabfe807401038582db29-7ea2a.html

[_Paz_]

How to add .scc files in Encore:

(Looks as if there is no editing here. Add and burn - only. I have to figure out how to get them to show up in PrePro.)

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sXSPLG1edW0[/youtube]

[Bob]

You can add .scc files to sequences in Premiere Pro CS5.5 and CS6, but the issues is exporting them. The feature was added for the broadcast industry where the video would be exported directly to tape or a broadcast server using a specialized hardware card in the PC. It wasn't really intended for adding closed captions to exported video formats. I don't know if you can even pass it to Encore using dynamic link in those versions. A few companies were developing plugins to export closed captioning to video formats, but I haven't seen them or know what they would cost.

Closed Captioning support is improving, but the extra features in the tutorial you posted came in with Premiere Pro CC.

See this one about adding closed captioning to Premiere Pro CS5.5 (it's valid for CS6):

https://www.video2brain.com/en/lessons/attaching-and-previewing-closed-caption-data

[_Paz_]

Thanks for the tutorial! Just what I need.

I've come across some information that says AVC Coding (Advanced Video Coding) can be problematic when trying to export video containing subtitles. Anyone know if Adobe's h.264 high definition is AVC?

[Bob]

AVC is H.264. The ITU-T H.264 standard and the ISO/IEC MPEG-4 AVC standard were jointly developed and are jointly maintained, they have identical technical content.

[_Paz_]

Thank you. Turned out that wasn't my problem after all, which is good.

I couldn't get the Preview to play in MovieCaptioner. http://www.synchrimedia.com/ The creator of the program asked me to send it to him via Dropbox, I did, he reduced the size in QuickTime Pro to 960x540. It works now.


Using MovieCaptioner I've been able to add closed captions/subtitles, still not quite sure what the difference is between them, and export the files for different uses. One file extension for YouTube, a different one for Premier Pro and yet a different one for Encore.

The YouTube file extension needed to be uploaded separately, that is, the subtitles did not export with the video from Premier Pro, which is what was expected.

On Youtube I can press the CC button on YouTube and have the subtitles turned on or off. I'd like to know if you all can do so as well, as I've learned what I see as the YouTube uploading client isn't always the same as a YouTube viewer sees.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCEChBt_tOs[/youtube]

I've learned that I can import the subtitle info from MovieCaptioner into Premiere Pro and using steps shown in some of the videos posted in this thread, be able to see and edit them. Upon Direct Linking the file to Encore, however, the subtitles are lost.

The .scc format imports into Encore but in an unreadable format. It's important to use the MovieCaptioner Encore setting. I've learned I can edit typos directly in Encore and change from left align to center align.

Now I'm trying to create my first Encore project. I'm going to have to download and install Library features from Adobe in order to have Menus and Buttons.

http://helpx.adobe.com/x-productkb/mult ... content-mi ssing.html

and possibly more from here:

http://helpx.adobe.com/encore/using/dow ... ntent.html

(See message #6 in Adobe thread: http://forums.adobe.com/message/5295589)

If I can burn DVDs with subtitles that can be turned on or off I'll definitely purchase MovieCaptioner, $99. (apparently needs QuickTimePro too.)
Info on the MovieCaptioner site indicates it can be used with Dragon Naturally Speaking although I haven't tried it yet.

Paz