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Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Specific to Premiere Elements Version 11.

Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby HSA » Sun Mar 31, 2019 10:25 pm

Bob, thanks for your help. I'm definitely in the cheap seats, behind a column.

I use Windows 7, Premier Elements 11
Adobe CS5, which I believe would include Photoshop Version: 12.0.4.

My source was VHS tape, 4:3 aspect ratio, which I believe you are calling "full frame standard definition". Loaded into Premier Elements, it automatically set the project at 720v480 pixels (which from everything I've been reading, is correct).

I had not heretofore thought much about it, but I understand your statement: "Both wide screen and full frame standard definition video are 720x480 pixels -- the difference between them is the pixel aspect ratio used. Full frame video uses a 0.91 pixel aspect ratio while wide screen uses a 1.21 pixel aspect ratio."

It seems you are recommending I set PAR to 0.91 even before I create the border mask. Ok, I now know how to do that.

You Recommend Next: Select the black background color.
-- The actual selection options are: white, transparent and background color. So I suppose your recommendation is to first set my background color to black then create this new document.

You Note Next: Guide lines at the safe title and safe action boundaries will probably be included, but you can ignore them.
-- I have learned that there are safe boundary lines in the "Titles" function of Premier Elements. But I am not familiar with safe title and safe action boundaries in Photoshop. But since they are to be ignored, I shall.

You Recommend Next: In Photoshop, convert the background layer to a normal layer.
-- Yes, I have done that many times. (Or I may right-click on the Background Layer and selected "Duplicate Layer". It is named "Background Copy"; it is a normal layer, but retains the original background layer, if that is one's preference.)

You Next Describe the Process for Selection.
-- I had best not follow your first suggestion: using the rectangular marquee selection tool, as my hand and eye would not be keen enough to make the sides equal. (But I did try it, deleted the center area, and it worked as expected. But my hand-selected border was far from equal sided.) So I moved to your second suggested course of action. I selected the entire black background (lots of ways to do that). But thereafter things fell apart. I cannot, as you suggest, go to Select>Modify>Contract, as the Modify>Contract and other options under the Modify menu are grayed out . . . except for "Border", which is operational.

Selecting Border does create a border of the number of pixels preferred, but it extends equally above and within the black box earlier created. Furthermore, there is no "check-box next to Apply Effect at Canvas Bounds". No such thing appears.

Thus, as far as I can figure out, nothing beyond creating the black box appears to work in my version of Photoshop as in yours. I'm stuck with a black box image in Photoshop.

If I were able to create the transparency-filled black border, I believe that saving the PSD file and importing it into Premier Elements would be no problem. But, as noted, all I have is that 720x480 pixel, PAR 0.91 black box.

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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby Bob » Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:58 am

OK, Photoshop CS5 works a bit differently, but pretty close. As it turns out, I still had my old copy of Photoshop CS5 which I used to verify the process and get screen shots for you.

Set the background color to black. This should be the default unless you changed it. Now open a new document, where the dialog says "preset", select "film and video" and then select "NTSC DV" where it says "size". It will look like this:

newDoc1.JPG


Change Background Contents from White to Background Color. When you do this, the preset will change to custom and size will be grayed out, but all the settings will be present and it will have a pixel aspect ratio of 0.91. Click "OK" to proceed. You'll get a note about pixel aspect ratio being for preview, that's fine, just click "OK" again. It will now look like this:

newDoc2.JPG


Note the blue safe margin guides and only a single background layer. Now go ahead convert the background layer to a normal layer and then ctrl+click on the layer thumbnail to select the entire image. As I described before. Don't duplicate the layer. In Photoshop CS5, contract selection doesn't work on a full image selection so it's grayed out. Instead, go to the main menu and select>Transform Selection. In the toolbar that appears above the image you'll need to type in some changes. Width and Height are expressed as percentages, you can override that by typing in a number followed by PX (for pixels). Your document is 720x480 pixels. If you want a 10 pixel border, first click on the chain icon between the width and height to unlock the selection aspect ratio, then type in the values of width and height minus 20 (10 pixels on each side). Here's what it looks like after typing the changes to width and height (highlighted in yellow). Click on the commit icon (highlighted in yellow) to modify the selection.

newDoc3.JPG


After the selection has been modified, the selection should be 10 pixels in from each side. Press the del key to delete the selected pixels. You will now have a black border 10 pixels wide with transparency in the middle. Here's what it looks like:

newDoc4.JPG


Note that there is only one layer and it is a normal layer, not a background. Don't flatten the image, you will lose the transparency. Save as a PSD that you can import into your video project.
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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby HSA » Mon Apr 01, 2019 5:40 pm

Bob --- WOW!

In my years of use of the full version of Photoshop I never knew there was a New Document selection PRESET for Film and Video. Then again, why would I know that? I use Photoshop for restoring old photos. I'm brand new at Premier Elements. In any event, great to know about that New Document PRESET (0.91 PAR and all).

Your directions were right-on, except I'll note that my screen did NOT show any "blue safety lines". Not at all. In this case it was not important. But I certainly understand that such safety lines could be very important if one were filling the screen with a title or such. Therefore, I'll have to figure out how to make them show for future use.

Other than with respect to the blue safety lines, everything was just as you described. I now have a SD mask to cover overscan lines in Premier Elements projects that source from VHS tape.

Now, I'll have to get your address through the private e-mail function; I need to send you a holiday gift. Perhaps a couple of tickets to the ballgame of your choice . . . in the good seats and no columns to content with!

Much thanks,

Howard
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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby Bob » Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:38 am

Guides can be hidden or shown. Sounds like your guides are hidden. You can toggle them on or off by using the keyboard shortcut ctrl+; or use the main menu: View>Show>Guides. Guides can be saved along with the image in a PSD file, but they aren't part of the image and only display in Photoshop -- not in prints, exported jpgs, or when a PSD file containing them is imported into Premiere Elements.

I'm glad I could help out. Knowing that you appreciate our efforts is reward enough. We appreciate that you support our site through your membership.
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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby HSA » Tue Apr 02, 2019 8:59 pm

Bob, I have one brief followup.

Recall I wrote that I have no blue safety-zone guides on the New Project>Film & Video background as shown in your instructions to me.

I am familiar with the VIEW>SHOW>XXXX dropdown. For example, I commonly show the GRID when I am rotating an out-of-level image. I can activate NEW GUIDES, SLICES, etc., but “GUIDES” remains grayed out, which, of course, would directly relate to the blue safety guides not being present per your instructions. And I'll add: I checked EDIT>PREFERENCES. Therein my Grids, Slices and Guides options are all properly set up and, as you noted, Guides should appear (if at all) in light blue.

I’ve researched the Adobe online help for CS5; I could find no specific reference to grayed-out or active “Guides”. Can you think of a reason why View>Show>“GUIDES” would be grayed out and unavailable to the user?

Thank you,

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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby Bob » Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:30 pm

If everything is working properly, the only thing that I'm aware of that would cause that to be grayed out is that there are no guides in the document. First, we need to determine whether it's working properly. There should guides present in the NTSC DV new document preset. Let's verify that by making a new document using that preset and before doing anything else see if view>show>guides is grayed out then as well. If it is, try adding a guide and see if view>show>guides is still grayed out then. Please let me know what happened when you did that.
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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby HSA » Wed Apr 03, 2019 2:59 pm

Bob wrote:If everything is working properly, the only thing that I'm aware of that would cause that to be grayed out is that there are no guides in the document. First, we need to determine whether it's working properly. There should guides present in the NTSC DV new document preset. Let's verify that by making a new document using that preset and before doing anything else see if view>show>guides is grayed out then as well. If it is, try adding a guide and see if view>show>guides is still grayed out then. Please let me know what happened when you did that.



Bob, I think I am affected by a poltergeist.

I created a NEW Document per your demonstration of the "Film and Video" (NTSC DV new document) PRESET. There were no safe zone guides, and under VIEW>SHOW, "GUIDES" was grayed out. Let's call it "inactive", which, no doubt, is why the safe zone guides were not appearing when I executed the Film and Video PRESET.

Ok, in the NEW>SHOW drop-down, the create NEW GUIDE option was active; i.e., I could create a New Guide. So I created a New Guide and moved it around a bit. I then looked into the NEW>SHOW drop-down and the "Guides" option was now active. WHAT?, you say.

So I closed out the (test) Film & Video document. Then started again at FILE>NEW>Film&Video preset. This time the blue safe zone guides were there! WHAT?

I closed out and created a new Film & Video preset document a couple more times. Each had the blue safe zone lines. Then I closed out of Photoshop entirely, relaunched the program and retested for the safe zone guidelines. Not there. Furthermore, the Create New Guide option had disappeared from the drop-down. I closed out of Photoshop then relaunched it. In the New Film & Video preset, the blues safety zone guides were back!

I have no idea what's going on, not unlike slapping your 1950s- and 1960s-era television on the side of the cabinet and all of the sudden the picture is normal again. Go figure. Any ideas?

Thanks again,

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Re: Current Thought On Removing Overscan Lines?

Postby Bob » Wed Apr 03, 2019 4:36 pm

A poltergeist seems like as good an explanation as any. ;)

I think there may have been a bit of corruption in the Photoshop preferences file that was causing the guides in the new document preset to be ignored and not be added to the new document. Adding the new guide seems to have acted like that slap to the side of the cabinet and fixed the problem -- hopefully! I suspect that creating the new guide reinitialized internal data relating to the use of guides.

If it continues to work one time and not another, it may be worth resetting the Photoshop preferences file by deleting it and forcing Photoshop to create a new default preference file.
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