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Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

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Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Tue Apr 17, 2012 5:05 am

I was recomende this forum, from a user one Adobes Premiere forum.

I got som Video8 tapes that i want to transfere to my Mac.

Bought a Grass Valley/Canonpus ADVC 110 and a Canon G20 H8/Hi8 camcorder PAL.

Connected the camcorder via composite (Yellow video - Black to Audio L phono), the camera don't have stereo out and the tapes is from a Bauer VCC 830 camcorder bougt i 91' and don't think it records in stereo anyway, but the camara is long gone.

On a danish sites it recomende to use S-video out rather than composite, there for i orderet a S-Video cable and will get the audio like with composite.

When i record in capture in PP, i get 3.6MB/sec (216Mb pr miniute) and when i look at the file info it is at Quality = 3 normal.
I can't post at screenshot of this from the file info

Can this setting be changed?
I can't find any setting when caputering that relates to this, and it dosent follow the project (it's the same, in DVCPRO50 or standard PAL project when capturing in the project)

I want to capture the same quality as the tapes, so that i got the best material to edit.
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Chuck Engels » Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:44 am

Hi Draco, Welcome to Muvipix :wcm:

I don't have the Canopus ADVC 110, but have the ADS Pyro Link which is similar.
There are no quality settings that I know of, I think this is just a standard default setting.

Don't expect too much from the capture but as long as you are capturing directly from the tape to the computer you are getting the best possible quality file. SVideo may help some and there is a higher model Canopus converter that actually can boost the quality a little but is more expensive than your model and includes time based correction (TBC).
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:21 am

Thank for replying.

I was just wondering if this default setting should be changed..

Are you refering to the ADVC 300 model?
I read about this one, but the price was too much, considering i only need this Video8 tapes transferede and then sell the equipment as used.

I was recomende using DVCPRO50 as project with my transferede files, because i was told this project offers more features in boosting color, ect. instead of using standard pal 48khz project.

Im still new to PP and video editing..
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby nkummer » Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:50 pm

Hi ... I have the 110 and use it quite a bit. There are no setting to change the capture quality as it captures to the DVI standard, which is 13GB per hour of video. I have captured lots of analog video of my vacation and also stuff from VHS tapes. No problem with the capture, just the original video :)
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Peru » Thu Apr 19, 2012 6:44 pm

:meet:

I've used the 110 successfully, too. I found no difference between s-video & composite.
As previously stated, your source video quality is the important factor.
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:49 am

Hi Peru

I don't know if the camcord supply's the best output or the tapes are low quality, because they have been put away for the last 10 years.. there for I just don't want to choose a lower quality output if S-Video would give at quality boost.
I try with the S-video cable later on.

Just recorde my first complet tape and got some issues.

1: If i press record and the play on my camcorder, PP stops short after telling me, no frames where capturet.
2: When i try using the "TAPE" button (what i found, this would tell PP, that i want to record a complet tape), it starts recording, but when i press play on my camcorder, the capture goes on PAUSE and don't start again.
3: Watch a video regrading capuring a complet tape, where "Scren Detection" was recomended, but if i use it (if i just press record or use TAPE), it only begings to record 10sec in the tape, but there is video and sound from when i press PLAY on the camcorder, therefor the first 5-10 seconds i cant capture.
4: Found that PP may stop recording if there is some static. After capturing about 40min, there is 2min of static (nothing recordet) this PP captures, but about 55min within the capture, there is a short "rolling" static, this makes PP stops recording.. promting with the save window. When rewinding to 53min and makes a new capture, PP recorde fine until the tape runs out.

The 4 issues, makes is a challange for me to capture, because im missing the first 5-10 sec of the tape and i need to monitor the capturing, if there are some static that makes PP stop capturing (I got about 30 hours of tapes at the moment, thats a lot of time monitoring the capturing)
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Peru » Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:36 am

Draco_DK wrote:Hi Peru

I don't know if the camcord supply's the best output or the tapes are low quality, because they have been put away for the last 10 years.. there for I just don't want to choose a lower quality output if S-Video would give at quality boost.
I try with the S-video cable later on.

I did that , too. I found no difference.

Just recorde my first complet tape and got some issues.

1: If i press record and the play on my camcorder, PP stops short after telling me, no frames where capturet.

Make sure to start the source tape (VCR) first.


3: "Scene Detection" was recommended

Scene detection won't work on analog tapes.

4: Found that PP may stop recording if there is some static. After capturing about 40min, there is 2min of static (nothing recordet) this PP captures, but about 55min within the capture, there is a short "rolling" static, this makes PP stops recording.. promting with the save window. When rewinding to 53min and makes a new capture, PP recorde fine until the tape runs out.

Yes, it can be touchy and time consuming.

i need to monitor the capturing, if there are some static that makes PP stop capturing (I got about 30 hours of tapes at the moment, thats a lot of time monitoring the capturing)

Yes, it is time consuming. :(

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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby nkummer » Fri Apr 20, 2012 11:37 am

Draco,
I have to agree with Peru, it is slow and time consuming. The problems you have are common to analog tape capture. Unfortunately it is somewhat of a manual process.
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:30 pm

Peru =>

1: If i press record and the play on my camcorder, PP stops short after telling me, no frames where capturet.

Make sure to start the source tape (VCR) first.


It dosen't make any differens.. When i start the source (Camcorder) before pressing REC.. the video and sound comes on the capture display, but most times Capture reads "seeking" og Capturing 00:00:00:00 even when the video and sound is running in the display.
after a couple or five tries, it begings to capture after 2-5sec in the video..

Some times it also does it when i first press REC and the play on the camcorder

Can't is force it to record?

4: Found that PP may stop recording if there is some static. After capturing about 40min, there is 2min of static (nothing recordet) this PP captures, but about 55min within the capture, there is a short "rolling" static, this makes PP stops recording.. promting with the save window. When rewinding to 53min and makes a new capture, PP recorde fine until the tape runs out.

Yes, it can be touchy and time consuming.


I change the sensiblty on the static.. because there is no problem if i rewind 5sec before and then record, it captures the static without any problems.

i need to monitor the capturing, if there are some static that makes PP stop capturing (I got about 30 hours of tapes at the moment, thats a lot of time monitoring the capturing)

Yes, it is time consuming. :(


I Know.. but i didn't think that i needed to monitor the WHOLE capturing..

nkummer => Thanks.. although i hoped, that the software could be set on REC then capturing everything.. but it seems as the software is a bit too helpfull trying not not record static or stop the recording, because it thinks its done capturing..

Thanks for your help! :)
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Peru » Fri Apr 20, 2012 6:06 pm

Too late now, but I remember Chuck saying to always have several seconds of tape recorded with the lens cap on at the beginning of each tape to allow for the capture's time delay.

I record 10 seconds of it an each new tape before I start filming.
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Chuck Engels » Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:27 pm

Yup, always a good idea like Peru says :)
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:47 am

Peru => yep, too late, only about 18-20 years :-D

Chuck => Thanks, but since i dont plan to use the Canon G20 for personal recording only playback and if i got an camcord it would record on harddrive or flashmemory, there would bee no need for 5-10 sec "black recording".

BUT... i think it would be a good idea to record 5-10 sec "something" before the "real happening".. and then edit the the file.. so it's not a sudden recording, but can use the 5-10sec for a smooth intro..
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Draco_DK » Thu May 03, 2012 12:20 pm

An update.

I recorded 4 video8 tapes, cutting out the static, line up clips and so on, no problems at all.

I spoke to my photodealer, who also records old video8 tape till DVD and tried his Sony DCR-TRV240e, just to see if there was an difference and WOW there where.

I hooked the TRV240e up just like my G20 via ADVC 110, put there where no static and the sound where smooth, no glitches or half spoken words.

First i thourght it need a clean tape, but thats not easy too buy, but i found a Sony DRC-TRV235e camera on sale and bought i and it had a Sony dry cleaning tape with i.

Tried cleaning the G20, but same result with static and poor sound.

When using the TRV235e via the D-Link (firewire), the result is like the TRV240e (no static and poor sound)

it's nice, just pressing rec in capture and it records all of the tape, no PAUSE if theres static and combining several small clips.

The problem might be that the taps trackes and the head on the G20, docent line up and the tolerance is different than the Sony.
What i have been told is that Bauer/Bosch might be a Sony camera in a Bauer body, maybe this i why the Sonye plays the tape better.

If i record a small test video with the G20 and plays it back via ADVC there is no static or poor sound.

I got one problem, that i when using the TRV235e/TRV240e there is a violet/pink line in the right side of the captured film, when comparing with the film from G20, there is no violet/pink line.. this line is in the whole film. (sorry but can't attach an picture)
Could this be that the tape dosent line 100% up with the head in TRV235e?
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Peru » Thu May 03, 2012 1:07 pm

Draco_DK wrote:I got one problem, that i when using the TRV235e/TRV240e there is a violet/pink line in the right side of the captured film, when comparing with the film from G20, there is no violet/pink line.. this line is in the whole film. (sorry but can't attach an picture)


I have at times gotten a strange line, usually on the bottom. I just crop it when I use the clip.
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Re: Capture Video8 with Canopus ADVC110

Postby Dave McElderry » Thu May 03, 2012 1:20 pm

I think you're onto it. In the analog days of audio and video recording you'd have a tracking adjustment for the heads, which physically moved the heads (the heads were all in one piece assembly) for the optimum playback. For audio this usually meant adjusting for the best frequency response curve but could get much more complicated than that; for video it meant adjusting for no jitter, errant lines, or other distortions. On some consumer machines this was a manual adjustment, on others the machine would actually adjust tracking automatically. Anyone who has used a VCR or analog tape machine is familiar with this. It was usually referred to as azimuth adjustment, but actually involved a number of different alignment characteristics. Sometimes you'd get a piece of equipment in which the heads were not aligned well from the factory. As long as you were recording and playing back on the same piece of equipment it didn't make any difference, since the misalignment on recording and playback was the same and cancelled out. But when you'd move that recording to a different machine it could result in problems such as you describe. Of course the ultimate test for this would be to see if it plays back correctly on the original camcorder, but you don't have that luxury. I would bet that there is professional equipment out there that would have the ability to adjust the heads to compensate for the misalignment in your tape, but it might get expensive for the transfer to have someone do it.
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