Smartsound Quicktracks crashes Pro CS4?

[munickster]

Oh, and my CS4 version is 4.01 (052 (MC:160820)). I tried an update again and didn't find any others.

EDIT-
Oops - spoke too soon. With the timeline working with 2 smartsound tracks on it, I clicked new item - smartsound. Poof! Disappeared before I could blink. I don't think this is worth much more time. I'll continue with PE4 instead if I want to use smartsound, I guess.

Dick

[John 'twosheds' McDonald]

Oh, and my CS4 version is 4.01 (052 (MC:160820)).

Dick, sorry this doesn't address the Quicktracks issue:

I have PProCS4 and, following Bill's comments, I recently purchased a a couple of SmartSound packs from one of their sale offerings so got (relatively) cheap soundtracks and the free version of SonicFire thrown in. I can understand why Bill 'waxes lyrical'.

[Bill Hunt]

John,

Have you used the SmartSound music in CS4? Have you had any problems? Since I only use it in PP2 and PE4, I had not noticed the problems that Dick was having. Had I, I'd have posted a warning with my comments on SmartSound's QuickTracks plug-in. This is all news to me, and unfortunately, I do not have a way to check it out.

Thanks,

Hunt

[Bill Hunt]

Dick,

Getting back to your testing. It seems that the PEK and CFA files are not being created in CS4. With most uses of SmartSound, the files are usually not THAT long in Duration, so the conforming can go pretty quick, but did you see a little blue progress bar in the lower right corner? Depending on which actual music cuts you use, many will already be 48KHz @ 16-bit, so conforming is not realy necessary. The PEK files, however are the waveform display files, but are usually created in the bat of an eye - about how long it takes your CS4 to evaporate...

I'm really curious about this problem, as I DO sing the praises of SmartSound quite a bit, and would hate to be leading people astray. I'm also frustrated that I can't help test for the problem, as I do not have CS4 and all works perfectly (after that one update) in PP2. I was unaware that CS3 & CS4 had changed anything in the Audio handling scheme, from PP2.

I wish that I could be more helpful in this matter. As has been pointed out, QuickTracks now comes bundled within PE7, so Adobe and SmartSound are working together. I can't believe that a fix could be that far down the pipeline. Here's hoping.

Hunt

[John 'twosheds' McDonald]

To answer your specifc questions, Bill:

Have you used the SmartSound music in CS4? - Yes. Recent example, I took a sixty second track that was in one of the 'packs' that I had bought and needed to fit it to a timeline that was 4:18;13. Worked like a charm, so very pleased.

Have you had any problems? - No.

Thanks, Bill, for bringing SmartSound to my attention.

[Bill Hunt]

John,

Thank you for the report. I just wanted to make sure that you had it up and running. Glad to hear that you are putting it to good use.

Now, I wonder what is different about your situation and Dick's. Maybe there is something that we're missing with Dick's particular problem, since SmartSound and CS4 work for you.

Hunt

[Bill Hunt]

Dick,

Predicated on John’s experience with SmartSound and CS4, maybe we need to review a bit, just to make sure there’s not something going on, that is totally different.

I’ll step through the general process of creating SmartSound Clips and you tell me when you are doing something differently, or when I have something wrong.

When my edits are all done, and everything is ready for the soundtrack, I begin. In the Timeline I establish the Duration for my upcoming SmartSound Clip by doing one of these two operations:

1.) If I’m going to add a soundtrack to the entire Timeline, I just look at the full Duration, lower right of the Program Monitor Panel. I usually have 02 sec. of Black Video at the start of the Timeline, and will decrease my total Duration by 01 sec. This allows DVD set-top player to get a lock on the Audio, so I do not loose a single note.

2.) If I’m adding the soundtrack to just a part of the Timeline, I’ll set the WAB (Work Area Bar) to just that area. If I hover the mouse over the left bracket on the WAB, it gives me the Duration of the WAB area. Now, I note that, and do not eliminate that 01 sec., unless I am starting at the beginning of the Timeline. In that case, I will not worry about the WAB and just place the CTI where I wish to end my SmartSound Clip.

Now, I have the Duration, that I will need. In the Project Panel, I hit new and choose SmartSound from the drop-down. This launches the main dialog box, and then I open Maestro, “Click Here to Select Music.” With Maestro open, I navigate through my music libraries, and decide on the cut to use, listening as I go. Then, I choose “Select” and it’s brought into SmartSound. Here, I set the Duration, and choose the version of the cut, that I want. One could also set “Loop,” if needed. At this point, I Save the music to my “Music” folder in the Project’s folder hierarchy. It also appears in the Project Panel in my “Music” Bin.

I next set the CTI to where I wish the music to begin, and drag the Clip from the Project Panel to the appropriate Audio Track.

Pretty much, that is all that needs to be done.

In Avid’s Pinnacle Studio, there is one additional feature, that is nice. You can alter the Duration of the SmartSound Clip, and it automatically recalculates the exact Duration, with the incorporated lead-out of the music. I hope that a later version of QT’s for Premiere does offer this feature.

If I need to alter the Duration in Premiere, I will Dbl-click on the SmartSound Clip. This brings up the SmartSound dialog box, and I type in the changed Duration. This will re-render the Clip. Then, I go to the Clip’s tail, and alter it’s length, to match the re-rendered Clip’s Duration. This is an extra step, beyond what is available in Pinnacle Studio.

How does this workflow differ, from what you are currently doing?

Hunt

[John 'twosheds' McDonald]

If I’m going to add a soundtrack to the entire Timeline, I just look at the full Duration, lower right of the Program Monitor Panel. Now, I have the Duration, that I will need. In the Project Panel, I hit new and choose SmartSound from the drop-down. This launches the main dialog box, and then I open Maestro, “Click Here to Select Music.” With Maestro open, I navigate through my music libraries, and decide on the cut to use, listening as I go. Then, I choose “Select” and it’s brought into SmartSound. Here, I set the Duration, and choose the version of the cut, that I want.

Pretty much the way I have used it so far (still new to me so still exploring!!)

[Bill Hunt]

John,

If you notice anything that might be different with SmartSound in CS4, please point that out. It just might be something to help Dick sort his issue out.

Thanks,

Hunt

[munickster]

Thanks guys, for all of the input on this. Bill, my process is identical to yours and John's except for one thing - I'm using the free Quicktracks and you're both (I believe) using SonicFire. I create the tracks the same way as you had described. CS4 doesn't crash until the tracks are safely created and saved. After CS4 restarts, the tracks themselves seem to be bullet-proof. I've not been able to get CS4 to crash with tracks that were created previously. So, I think it must just be the Quicktrack / CS4 interface some how. Oh, one other difference. If I double click a track in CS4 after the restart, I just get the waveform in the source window. I haven't been able to get Smartsound window to pop up without clicking the New Item icon in the project panel (and we know where that leads...). I looked to see if I had PEK files associated with the tracks I had created and they are there (didn't look for CFA, however).

Bill, you've gone well beyond what I would consider top of the line support, and I do appreciate it. However, since I can use the free Quicktracks with PE4 and the tracks seem to work fine in CS4 after that, I really don't think it's worth too much more time on this. It's disappointing that it doesn't work as advertised, but it's far from being a serious problem for me. Besides, if I do decide to purchase any CDs from them, it sounds like SonicFire works just fine. All I need to do before then is try out Quicktracks with PE4 and then try to figure out how to get the best deal since, as you've pointed out, this stuff is expensive. They don't have a particularly easy web site to navigate, at least for an old guy like me.

Thanks again to both of you,

Dick

[Bill Hunt]

Dick,

I have kept SonicFire Pro out of things, as I assumed that this was an issue with the free QuickTracks for Premiere plug-in. Everything that I have written of has been for PP2 and QuickTracks for Premiere (latest with most recent patch). Though I use SonicFire Pro 5 for some major scoring work, my discussion does not take it into consideration, as it is a total stand-alone program.

Am I correct that the crash happens as soon as the SmartSound Clip(s) appear in the Project Panel? This is before you have dragged the Clip from the Project Panel to the Timeline, right?

The Dbl-clicking to alter the Clip is done on the Clip in the Timeline, not in the Project Panel.

You've found the .PEK files - good. Those are the waveform display files. That there is not a .CFA file does not surprise me, as much of the music in SmartSound is 48KHz 16-bit, and would not need to be conformed (that's the .CFA file). I'll have to check, but I *think* that there will be a .CFA, should one use one of the 22KHz 16-bit source files in SmartSound. I'll do one, and look, but SmartSound (QuickTracks for Premiere) might be smart enough to make the conformation outside of CSx.

I know that you are off to other things, and I am flying out in the AM for a very long weekend with my wife, a cabin in the Smoky Mountains, great food and even greater wines. I'm hopeful that we can nail down the exact problem with QT's, though we will need to take a bit of a break. I also contacted SmartSound and asked for a few clarifications. If they either correct one of my assumptions, or offer something that I had not considered, I'll post. Don't give up completely. Since I so very often recommend SmartSound (on this board and several others), I have a vested interest in making sure that I am not steering folk to some pitfall. I also like a good mystery, and feel that resolution is not that far away.

Thanks for hanging in there with me on this one. I'll check back in a week, and see how things are going with this thread.

Hunt

[munickster]

Enjoy your time off, Bill. You deserve it!

Dick

[SmartSound Frank]

Hello munickster,

While I can't go into too much detail, the reason Quicktracks is currently not supported in Adobe CS3 and CS4 is due to changes in the way Premiere handles plugins from a developer's standpoint. The current Quicktracks plugin for Adobe Premiere was created using the plugin architecture designed for Adobe Premiere Pro 1 and 2, Adobe Premiere for CS(1) and CS2, and Adobe Premiere Elements 1 - 7, and should work fine in those applications. However, until a new plugin specifically designed for Adobe CS3 and CS4 is released, there is not a stable way to use Quicktracks in those applications.

The best solution until that happens is to use the standalone Sonicfire Pro 5 application. You will have many more options to further customize your SmartSound music and can take advantage of multi-layer tracks as well. The Express Track version of Sonicfire Pro 5 comes free when you buy any album from our royalty free music library, even ones on sale.

In the meantime, a new plugin for CS3 and CS4 has been in development for a while, but needed to be completely redone due to the aforementioned changes to the plugin architecture in Premiere. Although we don't have a specific release date, we will notify you via email when it is ready. If you are signed up on our mailing list you will get the first notifications.

Please let me know if you have any other questions.

Regards,
Frank
SmartSound Software Tech Support

[John 'twosheds' McDonald]

Thanks very much for that update, Frank.

We now know the reasons behind the issue and that the remedy is being worked on. Thanks again.

[Bill Hunt]

Frank,

Thank you for taking the time to share the above information. Your message is appreciated. As I have often said, the support from SmartSound is at the top of my list for reasons to use their products.

Registering one's purchases with SmartSound has another benefit, getting you on the mailing list for updates! I normally strongly encourage this, for notifications on "sales," etc., but see that I need to stress this additional benefit a bit more, especially with some changes "in the works." I can also attest to SmartSound NOT filling one's inbox with "stuff" that is not important - you ONLY get notifications of sales, and new releases of either the music, or the programs - NOTHING else, so do sign up and you'll hear about all important releases, first.

Hunt