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A new old PC build for me

Talk about computer software/hardware problems, related to digital video or otherwise.

A new old PC build for me

Postby AVITRY » Mon Sep 12, 2016 8:18 pm

Hi all. Long time for me getting back to my elementary video editing. I enjoy stopping by though, now and again just reading the various posts.

Anyway, as the title says, I'm putting together a new computer for myself using some used parts and some new ones. The used parts consist of the motherboard and cpu. I picked up an ASRock Extreme 4 Gen 3 MB with an Intel i7 2600 chip. I'm using 16 gigs of corsair ddr3 memory.

I picked up on sale a new EVGA GeForce GTX 950 DirectX 12 2GB 128-Bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 SLI Support Video Card.

My question to anyone in the know :) is, while this board supports Lucid VIRTU switching between the IGPU and the discrete EVGA card, I don't know if it would show any appreciable gains for video encoding or editing.

Some say the IGPU is much faster encoding / transcoding video, while others say if you have a video card with at least 768 CUDA cores,(which this card has) you wouldn't really notice a difference. So this is my first question, which way to go.

Second, I'd like to ask. I have a few conventional HDs and I have a 250 gig SSD. I'm thinking of using the SSD as a boot drive and to hold PElements. ( BTW it's going to be a Windows 7 Professional OS) and use the conventional HDs as storage. Any suggestions there?

thanks all, hoping to get back to some VHS to DVD stuff I had to put off for a while.

joe
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby John 'twosheds' McDonald » Mon Sep 12, 2016 9:20 pm

Hi Joe. Can't help with your graphics card question but using the SSD as the boot drive is the way to go. You might want to think about putting the page file on a different drive (e.g. D:) if the SSD is getting too full. Also place the PrEl cache etc. files on that different drive.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Chuck Engels » Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:05 am

Hi Joe !! Great to hear from you, it's been a long time :)

I agree with John on the SSD being the boot drive. As for the graphics card, I can't really answer your question directly other than to say that is a good graphics card :like:
I have a GTX 960 4GB card and it is awesome. I think that for video editing the CUDA cores make more difference than anything else for speed and extra processing power.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby sidd finch » Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:01 am

I found this thread on Tom's Hardware:

Premier uses the vRAM on the video card most extensively. The more bandwidth and GBs - the better. The GPU only accelerates, but it does not calculate that much. The GPU can accelerate only what the CPU has already per-processed, so the CPU is your main bottleneck. This is also a reason why cheaper GTXs with more memory bandwidth win over Quadros that are twice the price.


http://www.tomshardware.com/answers/id- ... iting.html

Sidd
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Bob » Wed Sep 14, 2016 2:20 pm

Hi Joe,

You mentioned Premiere Elements, so I assume that is what you are using and not Premiere Pro. Premiere Elements does not use CUDA for GPU acceleration. That's a Premiere Pro feature. In general, Elements uses very little GPU acceleration and pretty much any modern video card will have similar performance with Elements. That said, Premiere Elements 14 does support GPU acceleration for rendering, playback, and export on computers that have Intel HD Graphics 2000 and newer. Your Intel i7 2600 CPU supports HG Graphics 2000. So, you may be able to get a hardware boost using Virtu to switch to the iGPU. Using the iGPU will use up to 1.7GB of your system memory, but you have plenty -- that shouldn't be an issue. I haven't seen any benchmarks. If you have Premiere Elements 14, try it and see what kind of difference it makes. Be sure to let us know what you found.

The SSD is definitely the way to go for the boot drive. I'm using a 256GB SSD for my boot drive and I love it. Next system I build I'm going to get a larger drive though. I only keep the OS and application files on the SSD and have my data files on a separate drive, but I find I still use up a substantial amount of the drive. A 256GB unformatted drive is only 238GB after formatting. My current usage is 178GB, but I've gone over 200GB. I need to routinely clean up the drive and get rid of the temporary folders and files that the OS insists on putting there. With 16GB RAM you probably won't be paging, but you will still need to maintain a nominal page file anyway. It's fine to put it on the SSD, but you'll probably want to avoid the Windows default and use a much smaller custom size to avoid eating up a sizable chunk of your SSD.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby AVITRY » Thu Sep 15, 2016 10:11 am

Thanks all for your answers. Thanks Bob for that insight into GPU usage. Funny how the more we learn the more questions come up. :) ----- Long winded story coming ;) so the questions come up in the last paragraph. :conf:

Aside from an occasional fun family video compilation burned to DVD, my redundant process is the conversion of VHS to DVD using my Canopus 300 and the Picture Controller software.

I've muddled along for a while with my two side by side computers. An old P4 that I use for web surfing and typing a quick letter or two while I wait for my video to transcode, and my i5 computer that I use for that VHS conversion.

Both computers running Windows XP Pro. The P4, cause that's all I need. But the i5 is still running XP because I'm half stubborn and half stupid. (Maybe a little more than half on the stupid thing. ) ( while I did purchase DVD Architect, I have a major brain blockage trying to make it do what I need.) I even bought Steve's book too!

I've been stuck on using DVDWorkshop to complete these VHS to DVD menus once they are edited and transcoded to mpeg. Mainly because the company I do the conversions for want the menu page a certain way and I don't have to jump through hoops to get DVDWorkshop to do it. (btw, dvdws won't run on Win7... maybe, I'll see)

Now, my old trusty P4 is giving me some issues. (probably power supply) but, I got the bright idea that I could use this excuse to move the i5 over to the P4 usage slot, use it for my web surfing, and build this slightly faster i7 to continue the VHS to DVD converting.

In addition, I could take my time and try to find an authoring program that runs on Windows 7, to do the simple things I need at my own brain dead pace, and wean myself off of DVDWS should it not work in XP Mode with VMlite.

Now, keeping with the brain dead theme ... :) I never considered how many other programs may have to be upgraded. I'm so used to Premiere Elements 3 that I'm worried it won't run on Win7 64 bit Ultimate. I do have Premiere Elements 11, though I'm really not looking forward to another learning curve. I use Nero 6 quite a bit, but, I just had to purchase vers. 2016 so it would run on Win7. And I don't want to even think about the ADVC 300 Picture Controller software not running on Windows 7, cause they don't even make that anymore.

Anyway, if Premiere Elements 3 won't run on Win7. I'm going to try to find out if upgrading to 14 from vers. 11 is worth it since I'll be doing the learning curve thing anyway.

Best Buy has vers. 14 of both Elements and PS for 80 buck. Student / Teacher addition. ( of which my wife and daughter are both [-X :no: ...... yes they are ... ::CLAP:

I may have bitten off more than I can chew. You should see my room here .. there's computer parts all over the place.

So, the questions. Will PE 3 and PS run on Win. 7 Ultimate 64 bit? And .. the upgrade price from 11 to 14 is $119 dollars, that's more than that $80 dollar deal at Best Buy? Is the Student / Teacher vers. different? And, is it even worth the slight increase I may realize in transcoding time. And, last but not least, on a long shot .. Why in the world am I doing all this? :TU: Always fun to talk to you all.

joe
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Dave McElderry » Thu Sep 15, 2016 10:58 am

FWIW, I had no issues running the Picture Controller software on Win 7. However, since upgrading to Win 10 it's kind of hit and miss. Sometimes it will recognize the ADVC 300, other times it won't. I do get the Windows "Bing Bong" when I turn on the ADVC 300, so I believe it's being recognized okay. I suppose it's possible that it's an intermittent hardware issue, but I'm really thinking that the software doesn't get along with Win 10. I've tried compatibility modes for both Win 7 and XP, but no happiness. But the bottom line is that I don't think you'll have any problem in Win 7.

I used to run PrEl 2 on Win 7, but that's been ages ago. The interface has changed significantly in the newer versions, but for the most part I do just fine with it. If you just allow yourself a little time to get used to it I think you'll like it. There are new features, but there are also features that were dropped from the older versions, so it's a tradeoff on some things.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Bob » Thu Sep 15, 2016 12:21 pm

Just to add another wrinkle to consider: version 15 is due to be released soon (usually end of September). If you wait until version 15 is released, you can buy version 14 and get a free upgrade to version 15. Be sure to save all your receipts/purchase orders.

The Student/Teacher edition is exactly the same software as the standard edition. Only the terms of use are different. You need to be a qualified student or teacher and supply proof of that in order to register/activate the software.

I used Premiere Elements 3 on Windows Vista, but I don't remember whether or not I used it on Windows 7. If you want to try it, you need to also install the Premiere Elements 3.0.2 update patch.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Peru » Thu Sep 15, 2016 12:35 pm

I was able to install Pre El 3.0.2 on W7, but not all functions work and it sometimes crashes.
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby AVITRY » Thu Sep 15, 2016 12:45 pm

thanks again guys ... Any info on vers. 15 features? Specifically transcoding performance?

It's funny, I used to transcode these videos on the P4. It was multiple hours of waiting. On the i5 it was less than a half hour. I'm anxious to see if the i7 is any significant improvement over the i5.

In the real world, it may only mean an extra vhs tape a day before I get tired. :) But its neat to see those performance gains.

A line my buddy, (God rest his soul) said to me that was funny, and I'll never forget. 47 years ago my hobby was drag racing. Sort of a parallel comparison to the trial and errors of computing components and performance.

Anyway, after making a pass with this old 57 Chevy gasser I had, we brought it into the pits and decided to try to get a little more performance out of it. The consensus was to increase the size of the fuel jets.

So, I said to my friend, "waddia think? Go up two steps is enough?" He said, " Na ... Listen, if bigger is better, then too big must me just right! Lets go up 4 steps" LOL.

Guess I'm still squeezing out milliseconds.

thanks again!

joe
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby Peru » Fri Sep 16, 2016 8:26 am

AVITRY wrote:thanks again guys ... Any info on vers. 15 features? Specifically transcoding performance?
joe


"Those who know can't tell and those who tell can't know."
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Re: A new old PC build for me

Postby AVITRY » Wed Sep 21, 2016 4:10 pm

Bob wrote:Hi Joe,

You mentioned Premiere Elements, so I assume that is what you are using and not Premiere Pro. Premiere Elements does not use CUDA for GPU acceleration. That's a Premiere Pro feature. In general, Elements uses very little GPU acceleration and pretty much any modern video card will have similar performance with Elements. That said, Premiere Elements 14 does support GPU acceleration for rendering, playback, and export on computers that have Intel HD Graphics 2000 and newer. Your Intel i7 2600 CPU supports HG Graphics 2000. So, you may be able to get a hardware boost using Virtu to switch to the iGPU. Using the iGPU will use up to 1.7GB of your system memory, but you have plenty -- that shouldn't be an issue. I haven't seen any benchmarks. If you have Premiere Elements 14, try it and see what kind of difference it makes. Be sure to let us know what you found.



Like I was saying before, the more you learn, the more confusing it gets. This graphics card I have is still in the wrapper / box, unopened since I really didn't want to waste money on something I wasn't going to take advantage of.

When you explained to me about the Intel HD graphics support on the cpu chip, it made me wonder why did Adobe decide to support just the Intel HD graphics on the cpu chip. I didn't even know what exactly the Intel HD graphics was.

I searched the internet a little to try to learn more, (more confusing on its way) and they mentioned OpenGL. So I wondered if in fact this would be something on the Video Card. I just don't know enough about all this stuff, Radeon vs Nvidea or anything. So, I thought what the heck, I'll chat with Adobe tech and ask if APE 14 supports dedicated video cards. Here is the excerpt. I dont know if my card is a 4000 or above. It's an EVGA GTX950 :ha: whew ... this is really confusing. I'd return the card if it was of no use, but... here it is, I have it, and I'll use it if it helps.
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